New SPK President: Fortunately, we have abandoned a national-chauvinistic attitude
A new start in the monster institution of the Prussian Cultural Heritage Foundation: A conversation with Marion Ackermann about looted art, women in leadership positions and money.
The new president has been in office since June 1st. Marion Ackermann (60) came from Dresden and, as head of the Prussian Cultural Heritage Foundation, she now presides over Germany's most important and largest cultural institution. And it is truly enormous. The New National Gallery , the buildings on Museum Island, the Pergamon Museum , the Hamburger Bahnhof, and the Gemäldegalerie are all part of it; in total there are 19 major collections, as well as research institutions. Ackermann welcomes us to her new workplace, the beautiful Villa von der Heydt in the southern Tiergarten. She hasn't moved into the large office yet, but she's already in a great mood. How does she feel as a new Berliner? And how does she intend to get all the problems under control?
Dear Ms. Ackermann, what are you most looking forward to in Berlin?
Finally managing to explore the many smaller cultural institutions and offerings. Of course, I've known many of them for a long time, so I'm all the more excited to now be a part of Berlin life in a completely different and more intense way. I spent my first evening at the Academy of Arts , where we discussed the role of Europe. The academies have been very committed to Central and Eastern Europe since early on, and I think the museums could become even more involved in this area.
What exactly do you mean?
Among museums, there's the Bizot Group, an informal association of major museums, whose composition has so far been heavily influenced by Western interests. Museums from Central and Eastern Europe are still far too underrepresented. Istanbul is also a part of Europe. Who is involved from Hungary ? Who from Georgia? I'd like to get more involved there.
Where in Berlin can you be found in your free time?
I have a dog, and through him, I discovered nature. I'm usually a city person, but my dog is a Jack Russell and loves to be active. So you'll often find me in parks, not just in cultural institutions.
What is your favorite restaurant?
I've only just arrived, but I already have a local café I like to go to, Zazza on Lehrter Straße. Incidentally, the third stop of the Berlin Biennale will be right across the street, in the former women's prison. Moabit is incredibly diverse in a small space.
Well, you were very lucky. At the end of January, the Bundestag passed the law reforming the SPK at the last minute. Ten percent increase , which corresponds to twelve million euros. Could you briefly explain to us what this powerful reform entails?
The decision was made to keep the large SPK network, with its museums, libraries, archives, and research institutions, together, while simultaneously making it more agile and flexible internally. Administrative processes are to be shortened and less bureaucratic. And the individual institutions, which enjoy global renown, are to be able to operate more freely in the areas that are important to them. Splitting the SPK along individual disciplines would have made absolutely no sense – it's much more productive to view the whole as an encyclopedic fragment and see what exciting energies emerge. And then, very importantly, also part of the reform: the collegial body.
What is it? That sounds like a very large body part!
That's funny. You could also call it a collective board. In these complex times, no single person can dominate all discourse. Starting in December, there will be a decision-making body of seven people, headed by the president. Each person will be responsible for a specific area—from federal issues to research tasks. Within such a framework, one can think about certain forms of social responsibility in a completely different way and act with much greater strength and scale.
What do you say today, at the beginning of your term in office: What are the priorities you want to focus on first?
Completion of the reform by the end of the year and the development of the SPK's content strategy. A key question will be how the museums evolve within the new structure, what happens at the individual locations, and how they interact within the overall network to breathe more lightness into it and incorporate artistic perspectives, as I did in Dresden. And it's about resources, which means, in addition to political discussions, also fighting for further opportunities, such as gaining additional financial support for specific thematic areas—for example, in education and outreach.
You talk about the much-demanded patronage, which unfortunately hardly exists in anti-bourgeois Berlin.
Exactly. That's why it will also be about increasing its appeal and visibility far beyond Berlin. The SPK is not a Berlin institution, but is supported and financed by the federal and state governments. I would like to specifically address personalities and businesses across Germany to reinforce the idea: The SPK also stands for the federal system. Of course, it must also be made very clear that everyone benefits from this.
I don't imagine that would be so easy. The notoriously cash-strapped countries could quickly get the feeling that their money is being sunk into Berlin.
It seems to me that something is beginning to change in people's awareness. Recently, the federal states have repeatedly made it clear that this is also their foundation. And they expect the SPK to have a presence in those states. We want to do more in this regard. This can only be achieved through many discussions, for which I would definitely like to visit all the countries, practically making a trip to Germany. But I'm also interested in global partnerships; it's about thinking big.
Which countries are you thinking of?
Well, it's about a 360-degree view! There are already many points of contact and partnerships, and we need to deepen and expand them. For example, we need to be present when the new Museum of West African Art opens in Nigeria this fall with the Benin objects. Berlin has made a strong contribution there by returning objects, and now a whole new chapter begins. Cooperation is often even more important to our colleagues there than physical restitution. They want to see a lot happening, from research to performances to workshops, and there's a vibrancy that's different from what you'd find in European museums. And it's about collaboration on a truly equal footing.
We should come and bring structures, ideas, people and money?
No. Visit and exchange ideas. Learn from each other. In China, for example, we'd like to realize a jointly curated project, and in Silicon Valley, we'd like to test experimental collaborations related to AI. I was recently in Stanford for over a week at the invitation of AI researchers and immersed myself in the topic. I'm convinced that we need to rely on the right partners and tools to finally facilitate global access to the collections. It's about scale and speed, and we need these partner companies for that.
Isn’t artificial intelligence a major threat to art collections like museums?
At the same time, of course, we must take massive action to counter AI. It's becoming increasingly important to recognize the constructed nature of images and texts. As part of our educational program, we must train people to deal with this: What is an original, what is an edited version, what is a fake narrative, and where are we being manipulated?
Should museums become schools of seeing?
They have been that way for a long time. This learning to see can also be extended to AI, which I think is important. At the same time, it's important to confidently demonstrate why we need art and culture right now—with their ambiguity, their scientific nature, and to open up spaces for thought.
You're known for your internationalization. Compared to Paris and London, Berlin still lags far behind in terms of museum visitor numbers. How do you plan to achieve this?
It's true: the collections are in no way inferior to those in Paris and London. Why does Berlin have lower visitor numbers in comparison? One answer is certainly that we depend on how tourism develops. This is important to consider when comparing it with Paris and London. One thing is clear: the museums deserve even more visitors. We will make the exhibition program even more eye-catching. And we will certainly make some changes in our branding and communication.
Will there be a new logo and branding?
I don't think a new logo would solve everything. There are many brands within the SPK, at different levels—for example, the Neue Nationalgalerie or the Museum Island . The Kulturforum could be more strongly branded as a kind of second Museum Island.
Kulturforum sounds a lot like the pedestrian zone in Kassel, doesn't it?
We could issue a reader appeal in the Berliner Zeitung on this. In Dahlem, for example, there is the research campus, FC Dahlem. A tongue-in-cheek name, which I like. But seriously, it's a great location for the foundation, even if it's not the center of attention. In light of the events in the USA, with Trump's exclusion of foreign students from Harvard University, we now have an obligation and an opportunity. American institutions are under pressure, and we are in contact with many of them. I dream of the research campus becoming a place where researchers from abroad come and achieve what they can't do elsewhere. I can well imagine that there are American patrons who would be interested in supporting us in this. So I generally think of branding more in terms of content.
You are the first female president of Germany's most important cultural institution. How important is it for you to be a woman in a leadership position?
It obviously plays a role for others. I know that women are often happy. It has also played a big role in my professional development. I sat on Angela Merkel's advisory board on women in leadership positions, and I already know how I can promote younger women. I look closely. And I am also very strict when I observe an injustice. It doesn't seem to me to be quite as acute as it was years ago, when minutes could still say: "We had to check the women particularly carefully to see how they came to be in their positions." The good thing is that you can control things in a leadership position.
There's an epochal shift taking place today regarding the identity of a museum. While for centuries it was all about collecting, today the primary focus seems to be restitution, the return of colonial or Nazi-looted art. This concerns objects that are wrongfully stored and exhibited in German museums because they came there under criminal circumstances. It's difficult for outsiders to understand this, but is it a good thing if there are now fewer objects in the collection instead of more?
First of all, Germany has been very well-trained in this area through the Washington Conference and the intensive examination of Nazi art theft, and has already learned a great deal. About ten years ago, we also transitioned from a defensive, hesitant, and very slow approach to inquiries in the area of ethnological objects to proactive provenance research. This has created a new dynamic, and that's a good thing. Above all, a different kind of collaboration has emerged, opening up new perspectives for us. And that's a really, really great development.
You define the SPK as a "learning institution," while at the same time, it has the mission of "preserving and cultivating the cultural heritage of the former Kingdom of Prussia." How does that fit together?
A national-chauvinistic attitude, that is, saying that everything is best kept with us anyway, so we won't give it back, is something we've fortunately gotten out of the habit of doing. Furthermore, every restitution is carefully considered beforehand. This is never done lightly, and the decision is always made by the foundation's board of directors.
Can you understand that conservative forces are a little afraid because it's slowly becoming clear that all the works in ethnological museums are actually looted art? So, they don't really belong there at all?
How do you define looted art? By no means does it all date back to the colonial era or from violent appropriation. The question is, how far back do we go in history? Back to the 16th century? Knowledge about it is important – the more proactive research is done, the better we can develop a way to deal with it.
From 2016 to 2025, you were Director General of the Dresden State Art Collections. The so-called "Bilderstreit" (Image Dispute) took place there, which, among other things, focused on the fact that Eastern artists were less appreciated and exhibited than Western artists. What did you take with you from East Germany?
For me, continuing to work on reappraising German-German history has become a lifelong theme. A lot has happened in Berlin in this regard in recent years, but we're really only just getting started. I think it's important, if only because of the history of the SPK, which after 1989 had to bring together people and collections from the east and west of the city, that we take the lead in this discussion. As I've spent the last three months getting to know the institutions with my "wandering desk," the question of Eastern biographies was often a topic of conversation with the staff. Incidentally, I can still remember very clearly how amazed I was at the reopening of the Gemäldegalerie in 1998 when the paintings from the east and west hung together for the first time. At first, we realized that the paintings from the west were much more significant. Only to then realize: No, they're not more significant, they're just better known. They're more firmly anchored in the canon and reproduced more frequently. For me, that was a very powerful experience of how significance is created.
Do you actually feel more influenced by Lower Saxony or Turkish culture?
I lived with my parents in Ankara until elementary school. I'm extremely emotional about Turkey, partly because I had a very happy childhood. What I took with me from there is the incredible friendliness and openness of the people, which still influences my work and attitudes today. Back then, Ankara was a free and intellectual city, strongly influenced by Atatürk's humanism and modernity. During semester breaks, my parents traveled across the country in a caravan, and we slept along the side of the road. Later, we moved to Göttingen, a border area on the border. More than half of my school class came from divided families. We were privileged to travel to the GDR every year for a one-way student exchange. And, of course, we tried to disrupt the system and create love affairs as quickly as possible.
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