Who was interested in killing Miguel Uribe Turbay? / Interview by María Isabel Rueda

Former mayor Enrique Peñalosa is the one who best understands Uribe's skills as an executor. He summarizes his personal and political qualities and addresses a troubling question: who could have been behind his attack?

Three years. Then he was our mayoral candidate. He always impressed me with his intelligence and his ability to establish human relationships. I think he inherited that from his grandfather, Julio César Turbay. His ability to connect with everyone and his fascination with the political world.

He didn't support me; he was with Rafael Pardo, against me, even though we were friends. But he was so convinced he was the right person for the job that I made all the arrangements and conversations to get him appointed, because it was politically difficult. I already knew of his human relations skills, but I later discovered other qualities in him that I hadn't expected: his work ethic, his discipline, and his aptitude for study. I was always impressed by how he studied the issues he dealt with. For example, he had to push through two important agreements for the metro, such as the financing process in the City Council and the creation of the Metro Company. Very soon, Miguel knew more details about the metro than I did.

Truly, super studious. That's a quality I never imagined, because social skills and political savvy don't normally go hand in hand with being so studious.

Absolutely honest. He proved to be an effective, results-oriented manager, which he delivers. A very cheerful person, loved by his entire team. And he also had to manage other complex issues that were ultimately resolved with the help of his successor, Iván Casas. For example, Mr. Petro, during his mayoralty, I don't know if he had tolerated, or even promoted, the invasion of land belonging to the ALO Sur. It was a tremendous fight to get that invasion out. Even Mr. Hollman Morris and others opposed it. Some of those buildings were already three-story buildings…

Yes, of course. It even cost us about thirty billion pesos. The entire Petrismo opposed us tooth and nail to removing those invaders, but we got them out. And thanks to the fact that we did that work, today the ALO Sur (Southern Highway) is under construction, key for exits like to Girardot and to alleviate traffic in Soacha and elsewhere. Miguel is also a great team player, a very important quality. I achieve a number of results, more than most rulers, because that's what motivates me, not power, but getting things done. And what's different about me is that most aren't willing to fight because they really don't care about anything. And on the contrary, I fight so much that people think I must have some personal interest, because it's not normal for politicians to fight. They think that if this guy is fighting so hard for TransMilenio, it must be because he has some business with TransMilenio. If he's fighting so hard over sidewalks and such, it's because he must have a bollard factory (laughs). Unlike Petro, who is an intergalactic genius (laughs), I'm clear that there are people much better than me, much more prepared, smarter, more specialized, who know much more about many topics, so my only skill is managing to choose people much better than me who work as a team. Because the obstacles and jealousies that exist in organizations are so great that they lead to one entity blocking the other. For example, to move any project forward in the mayor's office, the Treasury, Planning, Environment, the Water Company, sometimes even Recreation and Sports need to be working. Better said, to be able to push through the ALO, everyone has to get involved; there are ten entities and each one has to grant a license, and it ends up happening that a third-level official in the Ministry of Mobility blocks a project and it dies. The key is for people to work as a team. Unlike what happens now, almost all of my officials were with me the whole time; And the more the media or the councilors attacked them, the more they were screwed. The few people I replaced, it wasn't because they were stupid or incompetent, but because they were conflictive and didn't work as a team.

That's what I'm getting at. Miguel is exactly the opposite: a team builder. A person beloved by everyone, a conflict solver. Those seemingly soft skills aren't soft; they're critical in an organization. And look at the interesting thing: the only person Miguel has worked with in an executive position is me. He's been a politician, a councilman, and a senator, who are, let's say, more about talking. But about doing, only with us. And I feel we're almost complementary, because what I don't have, he has. And what I think he learned from me, he didn't have. He entered the world of public affairs, which he hadn't seen before. A world of executive technocracy, of those obsessed with doing, and perhaps that's why we sometimes even neglect the political and human management aspects. So I think we complement each other very well.

I've been there every day and have spoken, especially with his father. What I see is a miracle, because at first, unofficial sources claimed there was no chance he would live. But according to his father, it's now practically certain he'll live. Later, the issue will be the difficulties he'll have to overcome for his recovery. I'm not very religious, but I do believe that's a miracle. Aided by all the efforts of so many people. And many other things were miraculous. Like an ambulance showing up, or the fact that there was a neurosurgeon at the Fontibón clinic where he was initially taken.

That's how it was designed. It was perfect for them, because he was a young man with all kinds of conflicts.

Ah, that's the important question. Or rather, regardless of whether 7, 10, or 2 people were involved, the truth is that there's a powerful organization behind it. Who was interested in Miguel's assassination? Well, politically, one thinks there's only one way for Petro to stay, and that is for there to be such great disorder that elections aren't possible. This doesn't mean at all that Petro was the one who had anything to do with it; that's not what I'm saying. But maybe there's someone who is interested in him staying, right?

But look: as a guerrilla fighter, for him, his political ends justify the means. And for example, he's very proud, as he's said repeatedly, of the takeover of the Palace of Justice, where the M-19 entered, murdering a humble guard at the door. Second, I think he also has a very clear historical perspective. I'm a petrologist, not a petrophile (laughter). I've been following him for a long time. And what happens in history: those who write it are the ones who win. Third, Petro obviously feels like a very important leader, not at the Colombian or Latin American level, but at the global level. It's absolutely unimaginable to him that some "insects" like Uribe or Santos have been in power for eight years and he only for four. That hasn't even crossed his mind. Besides, I don't think he's interested in Roy Barreras or Bolívar or whoever else staying. No, Petro is interested in Petro staying. He has also told us in all sorts of tones and in very elaborate terms that the institutions of our democracy are illegitimate because they were created by slave-owning oligarchs and are a means to exploit the poorest. So, the institutions of our democracy are not democratic; they were created solely to exploit a segment of the population, so they lack any legitimacy and have no reason to be defended, maintained, or protected. Added to this is the fact that there are a number of illegal groups that have become very powerful in recent years. I don't like the spraying of coca; I am the one who most understands and respects the peasants who grow it. But as long as coca cultivation is permitted, it is inevitable that illegal armed groups will strengthen. That has happened. And to complete the picture, today there is an industry as powerful as coca: the illegal production of gold. Gold has had the highest prices in history, and that has also brought in a lot of money for illegal armed groups.

Of course, and he also said this was a fluke. I swear. And then they should be careful, because what the hell are more flukes? But there's no specific reason why they wanted to attack Miguel, in particular. Obviously, one alternative is that attacking him was more symbolic than attacking others, because he had a grandfather whom the M-19 hated and because he's a member and pre-candidate of the Democratic Center, anyway. But beyond that, it doesn't seem like there was anything in particular about why they chose him.

If not now, he has ten more chances—that is, between now and Miguel reaching the age at which Trump was elected—to try. Sooner or later, he's going to be president. I don't know if this time, the next time, or whichever, but if there's anyone I can bet 100 to one on, it's Miguel. Now, they're clearly going to try to sabotage the elections, and it's obviously very dangerous because there aren't just 20, 40, or 50 presidential candidates, but 600, 800 congressional candidates.

Exactly. It's a contradiction. And I'm very concerned about the calmness with which the government says that on the issue of the consultation, they will abide by whatever the Constitutional Court says, as if they were absolutely certain that the Court would endorse it. I don't see why they're so calm and so certain. And whether or not the prior consultation is approved is almost a first test of what the Constitutional Court's approval of not holding the elections could mean later. I think there's a consensus here that Petro would like to remain in the Presidency by any means, but there are no institutional mechanisms for him to do so. There's no possibility of changing the Constitution, or of having a reelection; he doesn't even have a majority among the population, nor is there time to hold a constituent assembly, none of that. So, there's only one way Petro could remain in the Presidency, and that would be if there were such an immense public order disaster that the elections couldn't be held. That's the only one. There must be someone who might be interested in that.

Yes, absolutely. I'm in favor of all of us who believe in security, in private enterprise, conducting pre-selection processes with surveys, if possible, and in the worst-case scenario, with a major referendum in March to choose a single candidate. There are some very interesting people. I'll mention a few names: Aníbal Gaviria, Pipe Córdoba, Marta Lucía Ramírez, David Luna, Juan Daniel Oviedo… There are also interesting candidates in the Democratic Center, and leading in the polls are Vicky and Fajardo, who in one way or another are on the same side. That's what I would dream of, because it would allow us to almost win in the first round. And, on the contrary, if all these groups arrive divided, for me the ultimate nightmare is that Claudia López and the Petrista candidate will make it to the second round. We can't allow that nightmare to happen.